In this episode of In with the Old, host Dr. Tim Howe talks with Dr. J. Daniel Hays, senior professor of Old Testament at Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary. They discuss his book From Every People and Nation: A Biblical Theology of Race. Dr. Hays starts with his own path to the Old Testament. It began with his father's class on the prophets, and it continued through Hebrew studies and missionary years in Ethiopia. He then tells how an invitation to give a conference paper on the Kushites turned into a book. He found the Cushites mentioned 54 times in Scripture, yet they are rarely covered in commentaries or on Bible maps. The conversation then takes up several questions:

• The "curse of Ham":

Dr. Hays walks through Genesis 9 and shows that the curse falls on Canaan, not on Ham or on Black Africans. He explains how the misreading was used to defend slavery in America and why it lingered into the 20th century.

• The Table of Nations:

In Genesis 10, the names include people, cities and nations. They are grouped by geopolitics, not by race.

• The Cushites:

The kingdom lay south of Egypt, in what is now northern Sudan, and it is not modern Ethiopia. Cushites appear throughout Scripture. They include Moses' wife, a soldier in David's army, Ebed-Melech, who rescues Jeremiah, and the Ethiopian eunuch in Acts 8.

• Interracial marriage:

God sides with Moses against Miriam and Aaron over his Kushite wife. Dr. Hays explains that the later biblical bans on intermarriage are about faith, not ethnicity. He also shares a personal story about a friend's family.

• God's plan for the nations:

Dr. Hays traces the theme from Babel and Genesis 12 through the prophets, Pentecost and Romans 11. It ends in Revelation, where people from every nation are united around the throne.

• Practical steps for churches today:

He urges listeners to see one another as family and to listen across ethnic lines. He suggests shared services and pulpit exchanges, joint projects and church plants, and multiethnic staff where it fits the community.

Time breakdown

• 0:00

Welcome and guest introduction

• 0:54

What drew Dr. Hays to the Old Testament

• 3:14

The story behind From Every People and Nation

• 6:44

The "curse of Ham" and how it was misused

• 12:01

Genesis 10 and the Table of Nations

• 16:36

Who the Cushites are and why they matter

• 25:23

Moses' Cushite wife and interracial marriage in Scripture

• 35:40

God's plan for the nations, from Genesis to Revelation

• 45:59

Building multiethnic communities today

• 54:03

Final thoughts and sign-off

Did people really live to be almost a thousand years old? In this Season 7 "Bizarre Stories" episode of In with the Old, Tim Howe looks at the ages of the patriarchs in Genesis 5 and Genesis 11. He reads both genealogies, then asks whether the ages should be taken literally and what they teach. The episode covers:

• Why death is the refrain of Genesis 5, and how long life can be read as a sign of God's grace.
• Enoch, and why walking with God matters more than how long you live.
• How the Sumerian King List compares to Genesis
• Context to determine if the ages are literal. Genesis 6:3, Jacob's conversation with Pharaoh in Genesis 47, and Moses at 120. Tim argues these show the text itself treats the ages as literal.
• A theory about how the pre-flood world may have supported longer lives, which Tim presents as speculative.
• What this means for us. Life is a gift from God, and Isaiah 65 shows the curse being reversed. In Christ, death does not get the final word.

Time breakdown

• 0:00 – Welcome and the question: how old were the patriarchs?
• 0:48 – Setting up Genesis 5:3–32 and Genesis 11:10–26
• 1:13 – Reading Genesis 5: Adam to Noah
• 3:19 – Reading Genesis 11: Shem to Terah
• 4:59 – Should we take these ages literally?
• 5:18 – Genesis 5 as a "reset" after the Garden
• 6:04 – Created to live with God: the tree of life and the warning in Genesis 2:17
• 8:02 – The refrain "and he died," and Victor Hamilton on length of days as grace
• 9:49 – Enoch walked with God: quality of life over length
• 10:58 – The ancient Near East and the Sumerian King List
• 13:05 – Is the Bible borrowing from it? Hartman and Wenham respond
• 17:11 – Genesis 6:3 and the 120-year limit
• 19:27 – The Hebrew word in Genesis 6:3 and Bruce Waltke's comments
• 20:57 – Jacob before Pharaoh (Genesis 47:7–10)
• 22:54 – From Abraham to Moses: the ages decline to 120
• 25:06 – The "generations" formula and why the text points to a literal reading
• 26:18 – How is it possible? A different pre-flood world
• 27:28 – The vapor canopy theory (Whitcomb and Morris)
• 29:38 – Lessons: God's blessing, worry, and the source of life
• 30:19 – Isaiah 65: the curse reversed
• 31:34 – Applying it: sin's consequences and union with Christ
• 33:31 – From the seed of hope in Enoch to the resurrection of Jesus
• 34:25 – Closing thoughts and the invitation to trust Christ
• 34:58 – Outro and sign-off

From Adam and Israel to the Church with Dr. Benjamin Gladd

Tim Howe sits down with Dr. Benjamin Gladd to discuss his book From Adam and Israel to the Church: A Biblical Theology of the People of God and trace the identity of God’s people from Genesis to the New Testament. The conversation centers on how the Bible presents humanity as image-bearers with prophetic, priestly, and kingly vocation, and why that framework helps explain Israel, Christ, and the church. They also dig into a major hermeneutical question: how Old Testament narrative signals meaning through patterns, contrasts, and connections rather than always stating conclusions directly.

Key topics

• In this episode, Dr. Ben Gladd explains why he thinks the people of God begin in the garden, not with Abraham, and how Genesis 1 to 3 sets the stage for the whole Bible.
• He unpacks the image of God as a threefold calling of prophet, priest, and king, with Adam and Eve tasked to rule, guard, cultivate, and transmit God’s word.
• Tim and Dr. Gladd discuss Eden as a temple-like space, including the mountain imagery, holy space, and the need to expand and protect sacred order.
• Dr. Gladd argues that the serpent’s entrance into Eden shows Adam and Eve failing in all three offices: kingly rule, priestly guarding, and prophetic condemnation.
• The conversation traces the move from Adam to Israel, especially through Jacob’s renaming as Israel, which Dr. Gladd reads primarily as a covenant and spiritual identity, not an ethnic marker.
• A major theme is the distinction between ethnic Israel and the believing remnant, illustrated through Achan, Caleb, and Rahab.
• Tim raises the broader Old Testament pattern of outsiders being included in God’s people, and Dr. Gladd emphasizes that this theme runs throughout the canon, not just in isolated cases.
• They turn to Jesus as the one who perfectly fulfills the offices of prophet, priest, and king and embodies the true people of God.
• Dr. Gladd explains that union with Christ becomes the way believers share in God’s people, both in the Old and New Testaments.
• The episode closes with practical encouragement to trace biblical allusions and intertextual connections as a way of reading Scripture more faithfully and seeing the Bible as one unified story.

Timestamps

00:00 - Introducing the book and the people of God theme
01:23 - Genesis 1 to 2 as the starting point for biblical theology
02:47 - Why the people of God begin in the garden, not with Abraham
05:56 - Prophet, priest, and king as Adam and Eve’s vocation
07:53 - Why the prophetic office is harder to see in Genesis
09:10 - Tim’s question on priesthood before the fall
11:03 - Serving, keeping, and expanding Eden’s sacred space
12:27 - The serpent as an unclean intruder in the garden
14:10 - Why Eden is incomplete, not sinful
17:52 - From Adam to Israel through covenant and continuity
18:20 - Jacob becomes Israel and a covenant identity begins
21:20 - Ethnic Israel versus the spiritual remnant
22:44 - Achan, Caleb, and Rahab as covenant contrasts
27:10 - The Bible’s repeated inclusion of outsiders
29:59 - Why narrative theology gets missed in some readings
33:14 - Jesus as the true image bearer and fulfillment of the offices
38:19 - Jesus’ priestly ministry in the Gospels
40:48 - Faith, belief, and trust in Yahweh and Jesus
45:30 - The church as prophet, priest, and king
49:24 - Why the larger biblical story makes Scripture feel personal
52:23 - Current projects and upcoming studies
54:34 - Final encouragement to trace New Testament allusions