When Bree's first job out of college went through a merger, she was in her early 20s, running video and social, and wondering whether there would still be a job for her on the other side. Her boss at the time, Mike Kline, was at the leadership table while the deal came together, and he was the one asked to sell it to the membership.

In the first episode of Humans That Work, a new series where guests tell the story of a major moment in their career, Bree Bartos and Pinaki Kathiari sit down with Mike Kline, founder and CEO of ThinkLab, Bree's very first boss, and her very first podcast co-host. Together they revisit the merger of two rival associations in the protective coatings industry, one marketed to staff as a merger of equals, from both sides of the org chart.

Mike shares what it was like to sell a deal he wasn't a fan of, why he felt people from the smaller organization were scattered and set up to fail, and what he'd tell leaders before the next one. Bree gets honest about the pay gap she discovered at a conference and the burnout that followed. And Pinaki makes the case for being honest about the job question first, even when you can't answer it yet.

In this episode, they discuss:
• Why putting people in silos is a mistake, and Bree's first taste of job crafting
• Hearing about a merger at the leadership table compared to hearing it in an all-staff meeting
• Selling a merger to the membership when you aren't a fan of it yourself
• Why the merger started to feel like an acquisition, and being outvoted ten to two
• Pay gaps, public Form 990s, and what happens when people find out
• Why trust can't be built without honesty
• Acknowledging that everyone's first question is "what happens to my job?"
• Letting two cultures coexist instead of smashing them into one
• Mike's work at ThinkLab helping people learn to build with AI

Thank you to Mike Kline for joining us! Connect with Mike here: LinkedIn

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Have a story or question about work you want to hear the hosts discuss on the podcast? Write in to our subreddit: r/humanatwork

Watch full video episodes on YouTube.

Connect with Us
Bree Bartos – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Pinaki Kathiari – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Chris Lee – LinkedIn | Gallagher Communication

Lottie Bazley - LinkedIn
Edited by Dave Casto - Linkedin

Special thanks to digital communication agency Local Wisdom (www.localwisdom.com) for really believing in our mission and making this podcast possible.

If this episode made you think differently, laugh, or even yell out loud, we want to hear about it! Connect with us on LinkedIn, and don’t forget to rate, review, and share – maybe with your work bestie… or even your boss if you're feeling bold.

A VP tells the IT team they have to come into the office on the Fourth of July because, in her words, it's just IT and they don't have lives. So the team lead asks if he can throw an office party to make up for it. She says go wild, and suggests he use the company card. Brisket, pizza, pies, and a bill over $6,000 later, the CEO is yelling at the VP and the company has a brand new expense policy.

In this Reacting to Reddit at Work episode of Why Does It Feel So Wrong to Be Human at Work?, host Bree Bartos is joined by Pinaki Kathiari and Lottie Bazley to react to stories from r/MaliciousCompliance, a subreddit for people who follow the rules exactly as written and watch what happens. Bree reads a Hall of Fame post about that Fourth of July party, then a brand new one that was only hours old when she found it, about an IT guy who was asked to monitor employee productivity and wasn't told to leave management out.

Pinaki calls the first story benevolent compliance, Lottie explains why a rule with no reason attached makes people dig in, and Bree shares a quick tip for keeping your work and personal browsing separate. Two of the three hosts had never even heard the term malicious compliance before this recording.

In this episode, they discuss:
• What malicious compliance means, and why it feels like the work word for petty revenge
• A VP, an IT team, and a $6,000 Fourth of July party that changed a company's expense policy
• Why Pinaki thinks the first story is closer to benevolent compliance
• Why a rule with no reason behind it invites people to rebel
• A VP's job is to lead and grow people, so what if the first move is asking the team what they think?
• A founder who asked for browser history reports on everyone, and the list HR brought IT a few days later
• Why your browsing history and keystrokes can be tracked, and Bree's tip for a separate work browser profile
• The question to ask when a task makes no sense: what problem are we really trying to solve?
• Checking whether a thought you're having is a story you're telling yourself
• Whether internal communicators are guilty of malicious compliance too

The lesson everyone agrees on: be nice to IT. Pinaki also wants a part two on malicious compliance and petty revenge, so tell us if you do too.

Got a workplace story? Share it on our subreddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/humanatwork/

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Connect with Us

Pinaki Kathiari – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Chris Lee – LinkedIn | Gallagher Communication

Bree Bartos – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom
Lottie Bazley - LinkedIn
Edited by Dave Casto - LinkedIn

Special thanks to digital communication agency Local Wisdom (www.localwisdom.com) for really believing in our mission and making this podcast possible.

If this episode made you think differently, laugh, or even yell out loud, we want to hear about it! Connect with us on LinkedIn, and don’t forget to rate, review, and share – maybe with your work bestie… or even your boss if you're feeling bold.

We also bring these important conversations to conferences and private workshops, creating space for real, meaningful change. Take the first step at www.whydoesitfeelsowrong.com.

Welcome back for Season 4 of Why Does It Feel So Wrong to be Human at Work?! Bree's kicking off this season with a question: Why does it feel so wrong to post about ourselves online? To help answer that question, she's invited on two of her favorite content creators and social media experts: Yanni Pappas, Growth and Marketing Strategist at Workshop, and Sarah Whittle, founder of Unicorn Social.

Check out Sarah and Yanni:
Sarah Whittle: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sarahwhittledigital/
Unicorn Social: https://www.unicorn-social.com/
Yanni Pappas: https://www.linkedin.com/in/yannipap/
Inside the Culture: Chili's | A sizzlin' comeback story: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eyqRnroMozg

In this episode, they discuss:
• Dululu is the solulu: being a little delusional to get out of your comfort zone
• Why Yanni switched from trying to sound smart to trying to sound like himself, and that's when people started listening
• You shouldn't use machines to find your human voice
• Embarrassment is a choice, and Yanni stopped choosing it
• Why 40% of LinkedIn posts being AI-generated is actually an opportunity for real voices
• Personal brand as a safety net in the age of layoffs, and Bree's own layoff story
• The difference between real networking and treating LinkedIn like a get-rich-quick scheme
• Read the room: when EGC helps a brand, and when it's a red flag about the company itself

Send in your work story or question: https://www.reddit.com/r/humanatwork/
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Connect with Us

Pinaki Kathiari – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Chris Lee – LinkedIn | Gallagher Communication

Bree Bartos – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Special thanks to digital communication agency Local Wisdom (www.localwisdom.com) for really believing in our mission and making this podcast possible.

If this episode made you think differently, laugh, or even yell out loud, we want to hear about it! Connect with us on LinkedIn, and don’t forget to rate, review, and share – maybe with your work bestie… or even your boss if you're feeling bold.

We also bring these important conversations to conferences and private workshops, creating space for real, meaningful change. Take the first step at www.whydoesitfeelsowrong.com.

For this one, Bree kicked the boys out.

In this bonus episode of Why Does It Feel So Wrong to Be Human at Work?, host Bree Bartos is joined by Jen Samuel, Senior Account and Strategic Communications Manager at Local Wisdom, and special guest Regine Nelson, principal consultant in employee experience and internal comms, author of The Comms and Culture Devotional, and founder of Rise and Rain, for a conversation Pinaki and Chris were intentionally not part of: why does it feel so wrong to be a woman at work?

The three of them get into hair and appearance at work, the ageism that cuts both ways (too young to be taken seriously, then suddenly too old), the emotional labor of deciding what to filter and what to share, getting diagnosed with ADHD and autism as adults, and why periods, perimenopause, and menopause are still treated as taboo subjects at work despite affecting most of the workforce at some point. The goal isn't to villainize anyone. It's to bring language to the stuff that usually gets filtered out.

In this episode, they discuss:
• Appearance at work: hair, makeup, and the exhausting expectation of explaining your own body
• The double-edged sword of looking young: reverse ageism early in a career, then ageism later
• To thine own self be true, then read the room and act accordingly
• Discernment as a skill everyone can practice, and why fool me once means never a second time
• Getting an ADHD or autism diagnosis as an adult woman, and how masking finally stops working
• Why periods, perimenopause, and menopause are still workplace taboo despite affecting most of the workforce
• Remote work as a quiet equalizer for hair appointments, sick kids, doctor's appointments, and bad days
• Maternity leave, flexibility, and the mental load that doesn't pause just because the job resumes
• Go to therapy. All of you. All the time.

🔗 Got a workplace story? Share it on our subreddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/humanatwork/
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Connect with Us

Pinaki Kathiari – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Chris Lee – LinkedIn | Gallagher Communication

Bree Bartos – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Special thanks to digital communication agency Local Wisdom (www.localwisdom.com) for really believing in our mission and making this podcast possible.

If this episode made you think differently, laugh, or even yell out loud, we want to hear about it! Connect with us on LinkedIn, and don’t forget to rate, review, and share – maybe with your work bestie… or even your boss if you're feeling bold.

We also bring these important conversations to conferences and private workshops, creating space for real, meaningful change. Take the first step at www.whydoesitfeelsowrong.com.

Big changes are coming to Why Does It Feel So Wrong to Be Human at Work? and this episode is where we tell you all about them.

In this wrap-up episode of Between the Seasons, Bree Bartos, Pinaki Kathiari, and Chris Lee sit down for one last conversation before Season 4. They talk through standout moments from work, both good and hard, get honest about the emotional labor of always being 'on,' and land on a genuinely moving conversation about change, risk, and why it's scary to let something you've built shift into something new.

Because that's exactly what's happening. Starting in Season 4, Bree steps in as host. The show keeps its two alternating formats, topic conversations and Reacting to Reddit at Work, but Bree brings her own format to the mix: Bree Has Questions, where she'll bring on guests with answers to the things she's been wondering about the workplace. Lottie Bazley joins as a regular co-host for Reddit at Work episodes. And a new bonus episode, recorded ahead of the season, tackles a question Pinaki and Chris were intentionally not part of: why does it feel so wrong to be a woman at work?

In this episode, they discuss:
• Standout moments from work: naming an emotional reaction in real time instead of suppressing it
• Toxic positivity and the pressure to always perform an 'on' version of yourself
• Why boundaries can't be an individual's job alone, the organization has to set the expectation too
• The coach model of management: telling people their role in the system, not how to do their job
• Why change feels nerve-wracking, and what it costs to keep things comfortable instead of better
• What's new in Season 4: Bree as host, Bree Has Questions, and Lottie Bazley joining as a regular co-host
• A preview of the bonus episode: why does it feel so wrong to be a woman at work, with guests Jen Samuel and Regine Nelson

Season 4 arrives in September. One more bonus episode drops before then. Thank you for three seasons of listening, and for however you decide to feel about a little change.

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Connect with Us

Pinaki Kathiari – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Chris Lee – LinkedIn | Gallagher Communication

Bree Bartos – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Special thanks to digital communication agency Local Wisdom (www.localwisdom.com) for really believing in our mission and making this podcast possible.

If this episode made you think differently, laugh, or even yell out loud, we want to hear about it! Connect with us on LinkedIn, and don’t forget to rate, review, and share – maybe with your work bestie… or even your boss if you're feeling bold.

We also bring these important conversations to conferences and private workshops, creating space for real, meaningful change. Take the first step at www.whydoesitfeelsowrong.com.

A manager hires a young, inexperienced salesperson hoping to train him up just enough to help grow the team. It works. Too well. Now senior leadership feels threatened, the manager admits he can't stand the guy's energy, and the whole post reads like a confession that success became the actual problem.

In this Reacting to Reddit at Work episode of Why Does It Feel So Wrong to Be Human at Work?, Pinaki Kathiari and Bree Bartos are joined by Bill Kuehler, co-founder of Resource Hero, and Sam Knight, fractional CMO at Resource Hero, to react to one of the more infuriating Reddit posts they've covered. Bree admits upfront: this one made her mad.

Bill does something unexpected: he steel-mans the manager's argument, genuinely trying to find the most charitable read before calling it out. Sam draws a sharp parallel to AI adoption and the current wave of layoffs. And by the end, even the manager's own line, 'I don't hate him,' gets called out for what it actually sounds like.

In this episode, they discuss:
• A manager who built a whole program around growing talent, then turned on the employee who did exactly that
• Steel-manning the worst argument you've heard: giving it the most charitable read before you tear it down
• Why 'we've been trying to push him down and it's not working' is not a management strategy
• The disruptor parallel: how this employee's reception mirrors how companies react to AI adoption
• Whether the layoffs happening across the industry are really about efficiency, or about clearing out comfort
• A possible ageism thread running underneath the whole post
• Nice guy is not a profession, and neither is being liked instead of being good at the job
• Why asking one simple question could have avoided this entire situation

This one pairs well with our conversation with Dr. Matt Zakreski on being curious instead of furious. Listen to them together.

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Connect with Us

Pinaki Kathiari – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Chris Lee – LinkedIn | Gallagher Communication

Bree Bartos – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Special thanks to digital communication agency Local Wisdom (www.localwisdom.com) for really believing in our mission and making this podcast possible.

If this episode made you think differently, laugh, or even yell out loud, we want to hear about it! Connect with us on LinkedIn, and don’t forget to rate, review, and share – maybe with your work bestie… or even your boss if you're feeling bold.

We also bring these important conversations to conferences and private workshops, creating space for real, meaningful change. Take the first step at www.whydoesitfeelsowrong.com.

Connect with Bill: https://www.linkedin.com/in/billkuehler/

He thought leaving corporate America for a startup would mean more balance. What he got instead was a bedroom that doubled as an office, a laptop always within arm's reach, and a voice in the back of his head telling him someone, somewhere, was noticing he wasn't working.

In this Between the Seasons episode of Why Does It Feel So Wrong to Be Human at Work?, Pinaki Kathiari and Bree Bartos are joined by Bill Kuehler, co-founder and managing director of Resource Hero and recent Salesforce MVP and Golden Hoodie honoree, to talk about the real transition from corporate to entrepreneurship, the guilt that follows you when nobody's clocking you in or out, and the community he built almost by accident that now helps hundreds of people every week.

Bill gets honest about the years it took to build real boundaries once his desk became his bedroom, the moment his wife talked him out of quitting a passion project that was only reaching one or two people a week, and how the same instinct that built a thriving volunteer community is now shaping how he's rolling AI tools out across his own team.

In this episode, they discuss:
• Why leaving corporate for a startup often makes work-life balance harder, not easier, at least at first
• The nagging guilt of not knowing who 'they' are, but feeling like they're watching anyway
• Building real breakpoints into a day nobody else is structuring for you
• Are you helping those one or two people? Then it's worth it, the conversation that kept a community from folding
• Going from 80% technical, 20% community to 60% community, 40% technical, and what that shift says about what people actually need
• Rolling out AI tools across a small team without losing the human, creative parts of the work
• Use AI to think with you, not for you
• The joy of over-analyzing your own grocery receipts and workout data just because you can

Plus: Bill's advice for anyone quietly wondering if their tiny side project is even worth continuing.

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Connect with Us

Pinaki Kathiari – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Chris Lee – LinkedIn | Gallagher Communication

Bree Bartos – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Special thanks to digital communication agency Local Wisdom (www.localwisdom.com) for really believing in our mission and making this podcast possible.

If this episode made you think differently, laugh, or even yell out loud, we want to hear about it! Connect with us on LinkedIn, and don’t forget to rate, review, and share – maybe with your work bestie… or even your boss if you're feeling bold.

We also bring these important conversations to conferences and private workshops, creating space for real, meaningful change. Take the first step at www.whydoesitfeelsowrong.com.

A manager gets promoted from peer to boss. He switches the team from weekly meetings to daily. He opens every single one by asking about hobbies, dinner, the dog. He texts stream-of-consciousness updates about his life throughout the day and gets annoyed when the emoji reactions aren't enthusiastic enough. Meanwhile he's micromanaging, taking out company stress on the team, and nobody's salary has moved.

In this Reacting to Reddit at Work episode of Why Does It Feel So Wrong to Be Human at Work?, Pinaki Kathiari and Bree Bartos are joined again by Lottie Bazley, internal communications manager, to react to a Reddit post titled: how do I communicate to my micromanaging manager that I don't want to be friends?

Lottie brings a story from early in her career about the exact dynamic at the center of this post, peers suddenly turned into managers, with zero training on how to navigate the shift. The three of them work through what actually changed the OP's situation (a comment revealing just how overworked they already are), why 'what was going through your mind' beats 'why did you do this' every time, and why finding the win-win beats putting a target on your own back.

In this episode, they discuss:
• Why promoting someone from peer to manager overnight breaks the relationship if nobody names it
• The bandaid problem: responding slower or using emojis doesn't fix anything, it just trains the behavior around it
• Confronting a dynamic early instead of letting resentment build in silence
• The one-line reframe that changes every hard conversation: 'what was going through your mind' instead of 'why did you do this'
• Leading with facts, not feelings, when you don't have the emotional capital to spend
• Why 100% capacity actually means you're already overworked, there's no room for anything unplanned
• The real fear underneath OP's silence: not wanting to become the difficult employee who gets cut first
• Framing the ask as a win-win instead of a complaint

This one pairs well with our episode on code-switching and emotional labor, also with Lottie. Listen to them together.

Connect with Lottie! Visit her LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lottie-bazley-736633112/
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Connect with Us

Pinaki Kathiari – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Chris Lee – LinkedIn | Gallagher Communication

Bree Bartos – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Special thanks to digital communication agency Local Wisdom (www.localwisdom.com) for really believing in our mission and making this podcast possible.

If this episode made you think differently, laugh, or even yell out loud, we want to hear about it! Connect with us on LinkedIn, and don’t forget to rate, review, and share – maybe with your work bestie… or even your boss if you're feeling bold.

We also bring these important conversations to conferences and private workshops, creating space for real, meaningful change. Take the first step at www.whydoesitfeelsowrong.com.