This is a Vintage episode from 2006.

Jay Weinstein, author of The Ethical Gourmet, explains how everyday food choices affect farmers, animals, workers, the environment—and what ultimately ends up on the plate.

Why This Episode Matters

• Why inexpensive food may carry environmental and taxpayer-funded costs that are hidden from shoppers
• How farm subsidies can favor industrial agriculture over smaller farms
• Why ethical production and better flavor often meet at the same farm
• Practical ways to buy more responsibly without attempting dietary sainthood
• The enduring value of local farms, CSAs, seasonal produce, and preserving food at its peak

Banter

Mark and Francis begin with an important distinction: a cookout is not necessarily barbecue. From college pig roasts that finished around 2:00 a.m. to whole-hog dining in Manhattan, the conversation becomes a loving tribute to smoke, pork, poor planning, and the dangerous optimism of hungry men.

The Conversation

Jay Weinstein joins the show to discuss The Ethical Gourmet and the confusion surrounding terms such as organic, natural, local, humane, and sustainable. He argues that diners do not need to solve every problem in the food system; even switching to products such as organic dairy and eggs can support better farming practices. The discussion examines the hidden costs of inexpensive food, including agricultural subsidies, petroleum-based fertilizers, industrial production, and the pressure placed on smaller farms. Jay, Mark, and Francis also explore whether ethically raised food necessarily tastes better, agreeing that the difference becomes especially clear with well-raised chicken, meat, eggs, and ripe seasonal produce. The conversation closes with local farms, CSAs, preserving tomatoes and fruit, and one essential summer commandment: do not refrigerate a good tomato.

Timestamps

0:00 Cookouts, real barbecue, and the hazards of roasting a whole pig
7:25 Jay Weinstein and the idea behind The Ethical Gourmet
10:25 One simple ethical food choice anyone can make
16:35 Can ordinary families afford ethically produced food?
19:00 The hidden costs of cheap food and agricultural subsidies
24:00 Local farms, CSAs, seasonal produce, and preserving the harvest
31:00 Why good tomatoes should never be refrigerated

Bio

Jay Weinstein is a chef, journalist, and author of The Ethical Gourmet. His work has appeared in publications including The New York Times and Travel + Leisure, and he previously cooked at Le Bernardin.

Info

The Ethical Gourmet by Jay Weinstein

C-A-J-A-C-H-I-N-A, https://lacajachina.com/

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Recorded live before an audience at Sunken Harbor Club in Brooklyn.

Why This Episode Matters

• Gage & Tollner’s revival shows how a historic restaurant can be preserved without turning it into a museum.
• Sunken Harbor Club demonstrates how tropical cocktail history can be reworked through modern technique, research, and strong storytelling.
• St. John and Garret offer practical insight into crowdfunding, opening during COVID, and building a destination bar above a landmark restaurant.
• The conversation connects serious non-alcoholic cocktails, classic steakhouse drinks, the Martini, and Charles H. Baker Jr. to the larger evolution of cocktail culture.

The Conversation

The live conversation opens with Mark admitting that it took him several meetings to realize writer St. John Frizell and bartender “Sinjin” Frizell were the same person. Francis recalls Garret recognizing The Restaurant Guys at Tales of the Cocktail, back when being recognized in public was still a notable event.

From there, St. John tells the improbable story of finding Gage & Tollner’s landmarked interior beneath the remains of a TGI Fridays, an Arby’s, and a makeshift mall. He explains how 450 crowdfunding investors helped revive the historic Brooklyn oyster and chophouse and how the restaurant was preparing to open when COVID closed New York.

Garret traces Sunken Harbor Club from a weekly pop-up to one of the country’s most distinctive cocktail bars. He explores forgotten tropical formats, historic steakhouse drinks, the challenge of creating serious non-alcoholic cocktails, and the timelessness of the Martini.

The conversation also reaches Charles H. Baker Jr., his amazing life and the idea that a great drink can be built as much on story and context as on the recipe itself.

Timestamps

00:00 Live from Sunken Harbor Club
02:00 St. John, Sinjin and a James Bond pronunciation lesson
04:00 Garret’s first encounter with The Restaurant Guys
05:30 The opening cocktails and Sunken Harbor’s menu philosophy
08:30 Gage & Tollner prepares to open as COVID closes New York
11:00 How the Sunken Harbor Club began as a weekly pop-up
14:00 Finding Gage & Tollner behind false walls
17:00 Raising $450,000 from 450 crowdfunding investors
20:00 Reconstructing forgotten cocktails and the Cross Current
25:30 Historic steakhouse drinks meet tropical cocktails
30:30 Why serious non-alcoholic cocktails are so difficult
42:00 Martinis, Charles H. Baker and cocktails built around stories

Bios

St. John Frizell is a writer, restaurateur and co-owner of Gage & Tollner and Sunken Harbor Club in Brooklyn. His work has appeared in publications including Bon Appétit, Saveur and Punch, and he is also the founder of the acclaimed Red Hook restaurant and bar Fort Defiance and a noted authority on cocktail writer and adventurer Charles H. Baker Jr.

Garret Richard is the Chief Cocktail Officer of Sunken Harbor Club and the co-author, with Ben Schaffer, of Tropical Standard. His career includes acclaimed cocktail programs at Existing Conditions, Slowly Shirley, ZZ’s Clam Bar and Exotica, and VinePair named him its 2024 Next Wave Bartender of the Year.

Info

Sunken Harbor Club
Brooklyn, New York

Gage & Tollner
Brooklyn, New York

Tropical Standard
By Garret Richard and Ben Schaffer

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This is a Vintage episode from 2005.

The Restaurant Guys welcome Launny Steffens, co-founder of Vineyard 7 & 8 in Napa Valley’s Spring Mountain District, for a conversation about mountain fruit, terroir, and the pursuit of a more food-friendly California Cabernet Sauvignon.

Why This Episode Matters

• Launny explains why he chose Spring Mountain for Vineyard 7 & 8 and why elevation, slope, fog, and sun exposure matter in Napa Cabernet.
• The conversation explores terroir in practical terms: how land, weather, soil, and farming choices show up in the glass.
• The Guys discuss the tension between powerful “cult Cabernet” styles and wines built with more restraint and food in mind.
• Launny shares the reality behind the romance of owning a winery: expensive land, long timelines, and the old joke about making a small fortune by starting with a large one.
• The episode captures Vineyard 7 & 8 early in its story, when it was still establishing its place among Napa’s ambitious mountain wineries.

Banter

Mark and Francis begin with cocktail calories and discover that a Long Island Iced Tea is practically a meal with a hangover attached. From piña coladas to watermelon martinis, they make the case for drinking better, drinking moderately, and avoiding anything that turns one cocktail into lunch.

The Conversation

The Restaurant Guys welcome Launny Steffens of Vineyard 7 & 8, a Spring Mountain winery focused on Cabernet Sauvignon. Launny explains how he came to wine after a corporate career and why he believed Napa’s mountain vineyards offered the best chance to produce something distinctive. He talks about choosing a 15-acre site with vines originally planted by David Abreu, studying the vineyard through extensive soil sampling, and improving the health of the vines over time.

The conversation turns to the difference between mountain-grown and valley-floor fruit, with Launny describing how elevation, slope, and longer sunlight exposure influence the grapes. Mark and Francis press him on the risk of making a more restrained, food-friendly Cabernet at a time when bigger, higher-alcohol wines often attracted major scores. Launny says the goal was to make a traditional Cabernet that still reflected California’s growing season, without letting power overwhelm flavor or the meal.

After the interview, Mark and Francis reflect on California agriculture, local produce, and the appeal — and limits — of the slower West Coast life. The show then broadens into a conversation about sustainability, salmon, overfishing, short-term thinking, and why preserving food systems requires looking beyond the next market price.

Timestamps

0:00 Cocktail calories, moderation, and the Long Island Iced Tea problem
8:30 Launny Steffens joins the show and introduces Vineyard 7 & 8
10:00 Why Spring Mountain and mountain-grown Cabernet matter
14:00 Soil, farming, elevation, and building a healthier vineyard
16:30 Restraint, food-friendly Cabernet, and pushing back against bigger-is-better wines
21:00 California agriculture, local produce, salmon, and sustainability

Bio

Launny Steffens is the co-founder of Vineyard 7 & 8, a Napa Valley winery located in the Spring Mountain District. After a career in corporate America and investment advising, he pursued the long-term project of building a winery focused on site-driven Cabernet Sauvignon from mountain fruit.

Info
Vineyard 7 & 8 https://www.vineyard7and8.com/

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Ray Isle returns to The Restaurant Guys nearly 20 years after his first appearance to consider where wine is headed and whether the industry has made something pleasurable unnecessarily difficult.

Why This Episode Matters

• Natural wine and biodynamic farming overlap in philosophy, but differ sharply in practice.
• Fifty years after the Judgment of Paris, its impact still reaches far beyond one famous blind tasting.
• Wine is facing real headwinds, including rising prices, intimidating choice and a growing disconnect from younger drinkers.
• The future of wine may depend less on prestige and more on accessibility, personal connection and the thrill of finding a great bottle at a fair price.

The Banter

Mark and Francis take aim at the advice that diners should never order the second-cheapest bottle on a wine list. They explain how restaurant pricing actually works and why that bottle may offer better value than conventional wisdom suggests.

Their better advice: tell someone who knows wine what you like, what you are eating and what you want to spend and ask them for help.

The Conversation

Ray Isle, Mark and Francis distinguish biodynamic farming from natural winemaking and examine the strengths, contradictions and occasional “woo-woo” surrounding both. Ray argues that natural wine has raised worthwhile questions about industrial production, even if some bottles cross the line from unconventional into simply flawed.

They revisit the Judgment of Paris on its 50th anniversary and explore how it gave California wine credibility, encouraged investment in Napa Valley and pushed established French producers to improve.

The conversation then turns to wine’s current identity crisis. Prices are rising, restaurant pours can feel prohibitive and consumers face a paralyzing number of choices. Ray makes the case for removing pretension, finding knowledgeable people to trust and remembering that wine is ultimately meant to bring people together.

They also discuss the Food & Wine Classic in Aspen, pairing serious wine with burgers and why discovering an exceptional $20 bottle can still be more exciting than opening one that costs $400.

Timestamps

01:00 – The second-cheapest bottle myth
05:20 – Ray Isle discusses Biodynamic and natural wine
20:20 – The Judgment of Paris at 50
31:00 – Wine prices, choice and younger drinkers
40:00 – The Food & Wine Classic in Aspen
45:00 – Value wines and Sancerre alternatives
51:00 – Learning wine through producers and regions

Bio

Ray Isle is the executive wine editor of Food & Wine and one of America’s leading wine writers. He is the author of The World in a Wineglass.

Info

Food & Wine
Ray’s book The World in a Wineglass
Food & Wine Classic in Aspen https://classic.foodandwine.com/
For other Restaurant Guys episodes about biodynamic farming check out Peter Byck and Shinn Vineyards

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This is a Vintage episode from 2005.

The Restaurant Guys welcome chef-owner Liza Queen of Queen’s Hideaway, a tiny Greenpoint restaurant where the menu changed with the market, the farmers, the smoker, and whatever was left in the kitchen by the end of the week.

Why This Episode Matters

• Liza Queen explains how Queen’s Hideaway built its menu around farmers, Greenmarket shopping, small quantities of meat, and improvisation.
• The episode captures a very specific moment in Brooklyn dining, before “market-driven neighborhood restaurant” became a polished concept.
• Liza talks honestly about the chaos of running a small restaurant: tiny kitchen, no air conditioning, long hours, broken equipment, landlord issues, and sudden press attention.
• The Guys connect Queen’s Hideaway to a larger idea: great food does not need pretense, luxury, or a white-tablecloth.
• The conversation is a snapshot of a restaurant that became a cult favorite by cooking personally, affordably, and very much in the moment.

Banter

Mark and Francis begin with a conversation about fine dining, New Jersey, and the complicated blessing of being so close to New York. They talk about what separates true hospitality from restaurant theater: a warm welcome, good service, and the feeling that the experience is being created for the guest.

The Conversation

The Restaurant Guys welcome Liza Queen, chef-owner of Queen’s Hideaway in Greenpoint, Brooklyn. Liza explains that the restaurant does not really have a set menu because the cooking depends on what she can get from farmers, what meats are available, and what shows up at the Greenmarket. What sounds like a concept is, in her telling, mostly survival: if the restaurant runs out of one thing, she cooks the next best thing.

Liza talks about moving back east after cooking in Portland, where she felt limited by diners who were less adventurous than she wanted to be. In Brooklyn, she opened what she imagined as a neighborhood place, only to find people coming from Manhattan, upstate, and even New Jersey after early press and word of mouth spread. The restaurant is tiny, informal, and very personal, with a front-of-house and kitchen team made up largely of friends she describes as imported family.

The conversation moves through smoked meats, Wonderbread, broken ice cream makers, root vegetables, and the daily anxiety of building a menu from what the market provides. Liza is funny, humble, and matter-of-fact about the work: 8 a.m. to after midnight, six days a week, in a small kitchen with a very big personality.

After the interview, Mark and Francis reflect on why Queen’s Hideaway resonated. For them, the point is not trendiness or thrift alone; it is food cooked thoughtfully, with excellent ingredients, without snobbery. The episode becomes a defense of the finer things in life at every price point, from a serious restaurant meal to a great hot dog, a real waffle with ice cream, or a neighborhood place that simply cooks what it has and does it well.

Timestamps

0:00 Fine dining, New Jersey, and what makes hospitality feel gracious
6:15 Liza Queen joins the show and explains the no-set-menu approach
8:00 Liza’s experience and desire to open a place on the East Coast
15:00 Smoking meat, winter cooking, Wonderbread, pies, and the tiny kitchen reality
21:30 Why great food does not have to be expensive or pretentious
29:00 Why great food does not have to be expensive or pretentious

Bio

Liza Queen was the chef-owner of Queen’s Hideaway in Greenpoint, Brooklyn, a small, market-driven restaurant known for its changing menu, smoked meats, pies, and fiercely personal cooking. The restaurant became a cult favorite for its informal style, excellent ingredients, and no-pretense approach to neighborhood dining.

Info

Hell’s Backbone Grill episode (referenced in this episode)

https://www.restaurantguyspodcast.com/2390435/episodes/17017079

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Hospitality consultant Preston Lee explains how restaurants can build stronger teams, earn employee trust and create the kind of human connection that keeps guests coming back.

Why This Episode Matters

• Why hospitality begins with genuine care, not a memorized script
• What younger employees need from restaurant leaders today
• How daily training creates consistency without overwhelming the staff
• Why the employee experience directly shapes the guest experience
• How AI may make real human hospitality even more valuable

Banter

Mark and Francis take aim at New York City’s new anti-alcohol campaign and its failure to acknowledge the social and cultural role of restaurants and bars. Francis proposes a protest involving drinks, campaign posters and social media…until Mark’s old college beer funnel makes an appearance and immediately weakens the case.

The Conversation

Preston Lee joins Mark and Francis to discuss why hospitality is ultimately a structured form of kindness and care. He explains how restaurants can motivate younger employees by providing purpose, clarity and consistent expectations rather than assuming earnings alone will create commitment. The conversation explores hands-on training, daily pre-shifts and Preston’s “drip training” approach, which introduces meaningful changes gradually and reinforces them through accountability. They also discuss creating hospitality between employees, recognizing when someone is not right for the organization and developing managers rather than simply promoting them. Finally, Preston considers how AI may support restaurant training while making authentic human interaction an increasingly valuable luxury.

Timestamps

0:00 New York City’s anti-alcohol campaign
6:35 Hospitality as kindness, care and purpose
17:00 What Gen Z needs from restaurant leaders
25:00 Drip training, accountability and earning trust
30:30 Building hospitality within the restaurant team
43:30 The 30% Rule, AI and the future of human connection

Bio

Preston Lee is a hospitality consultant, founder of The 30% Rule and author of The Hospitality Handbook: How Unconditional Hospitality Transforms Teams, Customers, and Companies. He works with restaurant operators to develop stronger leaders, more consistent teams and hospitality systems that can grow with the business.

Info

Preston’s book
The Hospitality Handbook: How Unconditional Hospitality Transforms Teams, Customers, and Companies

Preston’s site
https://30percentrule.com/

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This is a Vintage episode from 2005.

William Walker of Jersey Fresh joins Mark Pascal and Francis Schott for a conversation about New Jersey agriculture, local produce, farmers markets, and why fresh food tastes different when it does not have to travel halfway across the country.

Why This Episode Matters

• Jersey Fresh is more than a label. It is a long-running New Jersey Department of Agriculture program built to connect farmers, supermarkets, restaurants, and consumers.
• William explains why “local” is not just feel-good marketing. Produce picked closer to ripeness often has better flavor, better texture, and a much shorter trip to the plate.
• The conversation gets into the real economics of small farms: if New Jersey farmers cannot win on volume, they can win on quality.
• Farmers markets, U-pick farms, and seasonal forecasts all become tools for helping families and restaurants eat better while keeping farmers on the land.
• Mark and Francis make a strong case for treating Jersey tomatoes, strawberries, peaches, and farm stands like the seasonal treasures they are.

Banter

Mark and Francis cover stolen car seats in Jersey City, motorcycles with laptops in the saddlebags, and a glowing local newspaper article that names Francis “the mean one” and Mark “the rock.” The real question: after 70 hours a week together, who wouldn’t be?

The Conversation

William Walker explains how Jersey Fresh grew from a supermarket promotion into a broader effort to connect New Jersey farmers with restaurants, markets, and home cooks. The conversation covers farmers markets, U-pick farms, strawberries, tomatoes, peaches, and the simple reason local produce tastes better: it can be picked closer to ripe.

Mark and Francis also dig into the real challenge behind “buy local”: preserving farmland only matters if farmers can still make a living. Along the way, William offers practical advice on storing produce, including the all-important rule that tomatoes do not belong in the refrigerator.

Timestamps

0:00 – Jersey City car seats, motorcycle regret, and a local article about The Restaurant Guys
6:45 – Why local ingredients changed fine dining
8:30 – William Walker joins to explain Jersey Fresh
10:00 – Farmers markets, U-pick farms, and connecting people to local agriculture
15:00 – Why local strawberries, tomatoes, and peaches taste different
25:45 – Why tomatoes do not belong in the refrigerator

Guest Bio

William Walker was part of Jersey Fresh, the New Jersey Department of Agriculture program promoting New Jersey-grown fruits, vegetables, and farm products. In this episode, he discusses the program’s history, its work with supermarkets and restaurants, and its role in supporting local farmers.

Info

Jersey Fresh
New Jersey Department of Agriculture

https://www.findjerseyfresh.com/JerseyFresh

Link Home News article about RG from 2006

https://www.nj.gov/agriculture/divisions/md/prog/jerseyfresh.shtml

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The Ghost of Jerry Thomas Has Notes | AI, Dale DeGroff & the Future of Cocktails

Mark and Francis attempt the impossible: an interview with Jerry Thomas, the 19th-century bartending legend who helped write the book on American cocktails. With help from AI and a performance by cocktail icon Dale DeGroff, Jerry returns to judge the modern bar, defend showmanship, and remind bartenders that the guest still comes first.

Why This Episode Matters

• Jerry Thomas is one of the founding figures of American cocktail culture, and his influence still runs through modern bars.
• This episode uses AI as a creative tool, not a shortcut, pairing the technology with Dale DeGroff’s voice and deep cocktail authority.
• “Jerry” has strong opinions about today’s bar world: better ice, better vermouth, more care, but also too much ego, smoke, and overcomplication.
• The conversation lands on a timeless hospitality truth: a great drink is not just what’s in the glass; it’s how the guest feels.
• It is strange, funny, historically rooted, and exactly the kind of thing that could only happen on The Restaurant Guys.

The Conversation

Jerry Thomas, imagined through AI and voiced by Dale DeGroff, returns from the great beyond to take a look at the modern cocktail world. He is pleased to see bartenders caring again about ice, vermouth, technique, and classic recipes. He is less impressed by drinks built for cameras, fog machines, and bartender ego. His verdict is sharp: effort is not the same as excellence.

The conversation moves through showmanship, simplicity, cocktail books, bottled cocktails, with Jerry drawing a clear line between theater that serves the guest and performance that gets in the way. For all the novelty of the premise, the message is pure hospitality. It’s not just about the drink, but about how someone feels at your bar.

Timestamps

0:00 The Restaurant Guys bring Jerry Thomas back from the great beyond
2:15 Ego, excess, and why “arrogance is not flavor”
3:30 Showmanship, simplicity, and drinks made for the camera
5:00 Bottled cocktails, zero-proof drinks and Jerry’s final word on hospitality

Featured Guest

Jerry Thomas was one of the most influential figures in American bartending, remembered for his theatrical presence behind the bar and his landmark cocktail books. In this special episode, he is imagined through AI and voiced by Dale DeGroff, one of the modern cocktail world’s most important figures.

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