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In this episode, we talk with Josh Gryniewicz — storyteller, health communicator, violence prevention strategist, comic book writer, and founder of Odd Duck — about why facts rarely change minds, how narratives shape entire societies, and what a North Dakota rancher, a Chicago gang mediator, and your favorite cop show have in common.

Josh shares lessons from fighting COVID misinformation in one of the deadliest counties in the world, helping defeat anti-vaccine legislation by listening instead of lecturing, and working alongside violence interrupters who treat violence like a contagious disease.

We get into why strategic communicators obsess over messaging when they should be paying attention to relationships, why stories often outperform data, and why some of the most important national security work might look a lot like bringing muffins to your neighbors.

We also talk about:

• violence as a communicable disease
• why data alone rarely changes behavior
• COVID misinformation and the North Dakota experiment
• how listening can be more persuasive than arguing
• the surprising role ranchers played in defeating anti-vaccine bills
• narrative ecosystems, meta-narratives, and how beliefs spread
• cognitive dissonance as a tool for change
• trusted messengers and community influence
• gang violence, retaliation cycles, and violence interruption
• why fear is great for algorithms and terrible for conversation
• Law & Order, cop shows, and how entertainment shapes public policy
• walls-up versus walls-down communication
• social change through storytelling
• why narrative is cultural infrastructure
• how to build healthier communities in an age of polarization

If you've ever wondered why people can ignore mountains of evidence yet change their minds after one conversation with someone they trust, this one's for you.

Josh Gryniewicz:
https://www.oddduck.io/

Book:
Interrupting Violence

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MAD Warfare™ is hosted by narrative strategist Jocelyn Brady and cognitive neuroscientist Sean Anthony Guillory.
Edited and produced by Amine el Filali.

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