Trey Gowdy, former prosecutor and congressman and current author and host of Sunday Night in America on Fox News, reflects on why the ouster of his friend former Speaker of the House Kevin McCarthy in 2023 still bothers him and what it reveals about modern politics. McCarthy was the first Speaker to be removed by a "motion to vacate" in US history. Gowdy argues that a small faction of attention-seekers undermined majority rule and rewarded disloyalty over leadership. Gowdy traces how narrow margins and media incentives paved the way for McCarthy’s fall and the rise of his successor, the current Speaker Mike Johnson. Along the way, he contrasts today’s political chaos with the rule-bound fairness of the courtroom. The episode ultimately asks whether Americans will keep rewarding outrage or start incentivizing integrity.

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Philosopher and interfaith scholar at the University of Denver, Sarah Pessin, has written quite a bit about common ground, shared humanity, and what she calls "hard hope." And, she keeps returning to a poignant yet awkward moment she had on a bus as she thinks about the possibilities of connection in a polarized world. The bus driver that day gave an unexpected sermon to his captive audience of passengers. moment from her graduate days at , when her bus driver unexpectedly preached to a silent, captive audience. She reflects on how that experience shaped her thinking about sharing one's faith, public space, attention, and respectful disagreement. Our conversation covers the ethics of listening in a divided culture. Together, when wrestle with when attention builds understanding and when it crosses a boundary. The episode reveals how discomfort, humility, and empathy can open the door to deeper civic and interfaith connection.

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Fairmont State University President Mike Davis joins When We Disagree to tell a story about being wrong and how it changed him. After discouraging a young colleague from pursuing her dream of becoming a pilot, he realized he was giving advice she never asked for and learned the power of listening instead. The experience reshaped how he mentors students and leads a college campus, shifting his focus from directing people’s paths to helping them discover their own. This conversation shows why admitting mistakes is essential to leadership, innovation, and trust. It’s a candid and fun conversation about humility, growth, and learning to let go of the need to be right in every interaction.

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