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Two Tall Guys Talking Sales

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales

De : Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey
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 "Two Tall Guys Talking Sales," where Sean O'Shaughnessey and Kevin Lawson discuss a single sales topic. Kevin and Sean together have about 60 years of experience in professional selling. This podcast helps people in sales, sales leadership, and business leadership or company owners realize the maximum value of their company by improving their revenue generation capability. This podcast is designed to help those people enhance their companies' sales management practices, methodologies, processes, teams, and messaging. Sean O'Shaughnessey and Kevin Lawson are Fractional Vice Presidents of Sales. They operate their own companies separately but have partnered for this podcast to advise salespeople and SMB companies on successful strategies and methodologies. Kevin is the CEO of Lighthouse Sales Advisors. Lighthouse Sales Advisors is a sales leadership solution provider for small businesses. Lighthouse helps business owners navigate the potential pitfalls around sales growth, sales turnaround, or scaling up by leveraging sales acumen and decades of experience to build effective sales teams. https://www.lighthousesalesadvisors.com/ Sean is the CEO of New Sales Expert. He helps company owners realize the maximum value of their company by improving their revenue generation capability. He helps owners enhance their sales management, methodologies, processes, teams, and messaging.2024 Economie Management Management et direction
Épisodes
  • Sales Success Playbook: Ethical Gifting, Better Messaging, and Higher Win Rates with Sendoso's Kris Rudeegraap

    Sales Success Playbook: Ethical Gifting, Better Messaging, and Higher Win Rates with Sendoso's Kris Rudeegraap
    Mar 3 2026
    Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey sit down with Kris Rudeegraap, Co-CEO of Sendoso, to get brutally practical about one thing most reps underestimate: how to cut through noise without sounding gimmicky or "bribey." This episode breaks down gifting as a repeatable, ethical sales strategy that supports sales management and revenue generation, whether you're trying to break into target accounts, accelerate a stalled deal, or reinforce relationships with customers who already trust you. Key Topics Discussed Breaking through the gatekeeper and digital noise with modern sales strategies (00:05) Kevin frames the real question sellers are asking: what actually drives sales success when inboxes are flooded, and attention is scarce? The "right vs. wrong" of gifting: tactic beats timing (02:13) Kris outlines the difference between thoughtful outreach and a clumsy "gift-for-meeting" move that damages credibility. Building a gifting sequence inside your sales processes (ABM + long-cycle deals) (03:55) How to use gifting as a deliberate step in your outreach and pipeline motion, not a one-off stunt. Value selling through gratitude: gifts as relationship reinforcement (04:45) Sean connects gifting to thanking customers for orders and references—small moves that strengthen champions and improve revenue management. AI-driven gifting: recommendations, timing, messaging, and address intelligence (10:24) Kris explains how AI improves targeting and relevance, reducing research time and enhancing personalization and response rates. Metrics that matter: win rates, meeting rates, and attribution (11:45) Sean pushes for numbers; Kris shares performance lifts and points listeners to deeper case studies. Key Quotes Kevin Lawson (00:05): "How am I actually going to make my number? What is actually going to get through the gatekeeper… and help me meet my number?" Sean O'Shaughnessey (01:20): "How can we use tools like gifts appropriately so that we're not bribing the customer… but we are making it like, 'wow, these guys are pretty cool. I wanna talk to them.'" Kris Rudeegraap (02:25): "I don't think the problem is when to send. It's like the tactic of how you're sending is what could be wrong." Kris Rudeegraap (12:18): "We've seen [win rates] increased up to nine x by using gifting in the sales cycle… and… up to four x increase the likelihood of booking a meeting." Additional Resources Sendoso website (case studies and data studies): Sendoso.com Kris Rudeegraap: kris@sendoso.com https://www.linkedin.com/in/rudeegraap/ Sendoso on LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/company/sendoso/ A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast Pick 10 target accounts and design a two-touch gifting step that fits your current sales processes. One touch is for prospecting (to earn attention), one touch is for late-stage momentum (to reduce friction). The requirement: pair each gift with a message that tightens messaging around either (a) your value proposition in the customer's world or (b) a real personal detail you've validated. If you can't explain why that specific item fits that specific recipient, don't send it. This is business acumen applied to outreach, not arts-and-crafts. Summary If your outreach feels interchangeable—and your deals slow down the moment you ask for something—this episode gives you a cleaner play. Kris lays out how gifting can support sales management, sharpen value selling, and improve revenue generation when it's integrated into real sales strategies and measured like any other lever in revenue management. You'll leave with clear guardrails for what not to do, vivid examples of what works, and a practical view of how AI can raise relevance and response rates without adding more busywork. B2B Sales Lab is a private, member-led community for sales professionals who want actionable insights, not theory. It's a space to ask real questions, share proven practices, and connect with others who are serious about improving revenue performance. Designed and led by veteran sales leaders, the Lab is where strategy meets execution. Join us at b2b-sales-lab.com You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/ You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/ You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/
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    18 min
  • Sales Call Horror Stories with Steve Landrum That Teach Real Sales Management

    Sales Call Horror Stories with Steve Landrum That Teach Real Sales Management
    Feb 24 2026
    This episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales is a rapid-fire masterclass in what actually happens in the field—when sales calls go sideways, when leaders show up unannounced, and when a "small" mistake exposes a bigger gap in sales management. Kevin Lawson and Sean O'Shaughnessey are joined by fractional VP of Sales Steve Landrum to swap real stories with real lessons: territory planning that's more than a map, sales processes that don't rely on charm, and value selling that holds up under negotiation pressure. If you care about sales success, business acumen, and revenue generation, this one lands. Key Topics Discussed 00:42 — The "relationship trap": knowing everything about the buyer… and leaving with no order (sales strategies vs. socializing) 03:15 — When you bring the boss and forget the basics: doing your homework and reading the room (territory planning and sales management discipline) 05:53 — Negotiation leverage in the real world: walking away, holding the line, and protecting revenue management 09:13 — "Two ears, one mouth": listening as a core sales process, not a personality trait 10:52 — Building a "secondary sales team": referrals, advocates, and credibility that sells before you speak (messaging and value selling) Key Quotes Kevin (02:06): "You're building relationships, yes, but you're in sales. You're not in order taking." Sean (07:23): "I want you to take this $20… because that's as much money as I'm going to lose to you today." Steve (09:13): "You got two ears and one mouth. Use it accordingly… Use it to that ratio." Steve (11:11): "A customer… will believe what somebody else says about you before they hear it from you." Additional Resources Dale Carnegie principles referenced (listening, getting others talking) — 09:32 StrengthsFinder concept ("Woo") referenced — 09:51 Steve Landrum https://www.linkedin.com/in/steve-landrum1/ and slandrum@salesxceleration.com — 12:53 B2B Sales Lab community - b2b-sales-lab.com — 13:35 A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast In your next customer conversation, design a 10-minute opening that forces you to earn the right to talk: ask two buyer-centered questions, then stay silent long enough for a real answer. Immediately follow with one "proof prompt" that activates your secondary sales team: "Who else have you seen solve this well—and would you be open to an introduction?" This single move upgrades your sales processes, strengthens your messaging, and improves revenue generation because credibility enters the room before your pitch does. Summary If you've ever left a meeting thinking, "That went great," only to realize you didn't advance the deal—this episode will feel uncomfortably familiar. Between Kevin's early-career wake-up call, Steve's unannounced visit disaster, and Sean's high-wire negotiation story, the common thread is simple: sales success comes from disciplined sales management, tight sales strategies, and value selling that's backed by proof. Listen for the secondary sales team concept alone—it's one of those ideas that changes how you run calls, how you build pipeline, and how you protect revenue management. B2B Sales Lab is a private, member-led community for sales professionals who want actionable insights, not theory. It's a space to ask real questions, share proven practices, and connect with others who are serious about improving revenue performance. Designed and led by veteran sales leaders, the Lab is where strategy meets execution. Join us at b2b-sales-lab.com You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/ You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/ You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/
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    16 min
  • What Kind of Sales Coach Are You? The Leadership Styles That Drive Consistent Revenue

    What Kind of Sales Coach Are You? The Leadership Styles That Drive Consistent Revenue
    Feb 17 2026

    If you've ever tried to "coach the team" by telling everyone to sell like the top rep, this episode is your reality check. Sean O'Shaughnessey and Kevin Lawson use March Madness, dynasties, and training-room discipline to unpack a serious sales management issue: what kind of coach are you, and are your sales processes actually buildable, or just a personality contest? The conversation lands in a practical place: consistent revenue generation comes from systems, controls, and repeatable sales strategies, not heroics. It also flips the lens to the seller: if you can't explain why you're successful, you can't improve, and you definitely can't teach.

    Key Topics Discussed

    • 01:50 — "What kind of coach are you?" Recruiting stars vs developing talent, and what that means for sales success

    • 03:10 — The "learning manager" model: systems, controls, and building consistency instead of one-and-done wins

    • 04:40 — Sean's coaching philosophy: taking B-players with A-player upside and building a winning system around them

    • 07:00 — Why peer groups accelerate growth: where to workshop messaging, revenue management, and sales processes without doing it in public

    • 10:05 — The seller's responsibility: understand your own value selling motion so you can replicate it (or fix it)

    Key Quotes

    • Kevin (04:25): "Prospecting needs to be consistent. It can't be something you do and sprint and then stop, and then sprint, and then stop."

    • Sean (06:20): "I don't necessarily try to get the C to a B, I'm more of a B to an A kind of a coach."

    • Sean (11:40): "When you say, 'this is how I would respond,' and somebody says, 'why?'… you should have an answer to that question."

    Additional Resources

    • B2B Sales Lab: b2b-sales-lab.com

    A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast

    Write down your personal "sales success recipe" as a simple, teachable sequence: the 5–7 moves you make that reliably create forward motion (your messaging choices, your cadence, how you qualify, how you handle pushback, how you ask for next steps). For each move, add one sentence answering "why this works." If you can't explain the why, you're not managing a sales process—you're relying on instinct. That limits your business acumen as a seller today and blocks sales management effectiveness if you're ever asked to lead tomorrow.

    Summary

    This episode is a straight conversation about what actually drives revenue generation: leaders who know how they coach, and sellers who know how they sell. Sean and Kevin connect sports coaching to real-world sales strategies, systems, consistency, and measurable controls, then bring it home with a challenge most teams avoid: Can you articulate your process well enough to scale it? If you care about revenue management, team performance, and value selling that survives turnover, this one's worth the listen.

    B2B Sales Lab is a private, member-led community for sales professionals who want actionable insights, not theory. It's a space to ask real questions, share proven practices, and connect with others who are serious about improving revenue performance. Designed and led by veteran sales leaders, the Lab is where strategy meets execution. Join us at b2b-sales-lab.com

    You can reach out to Sean at New Sales Expert, LLC - Sean@NewSales.Expert - https://www.linkedin.com/in/soshaughnessey/

    You can reach out to Kevin at Lighthouse Sales Advisors & Sales Xceleration - kevin@lighthousesalesadvisors.com - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kwlawson/

    You can book time on Kevin's calendar at https://lighthousesalesadvisors.pipedrive.com/scheduler/JP7rZXH3/virtual-meeting-booking-time-with-kevin

    You can book time on Sean's calendar at http://newsales.expert/sean-oshaughnessey-calendar/
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    15 min
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