Scott trades his usual host chair for the guest seat to share what happened during five weeks on the Camino de Santiago, with his son Ryan joining him for the final 300 kilometers. What looked on paper like manageable 15-to-20-mile days became a lesson in cumulative fatigue, infected blisters, carrying a pack, and doing it all again the next morning. Along the way, Scott discovered something unexpected: weeks of slow, steady walking left him remarkably fit, dropping his resting heart rate by 10 beats and making his first run home feel almost effortless. But the real story became the people, from more than 100 meaningful encounters to intimate conversations with complete strangers and friendships that crossed languages and cultures. Scott and Ryan reflect on the Camino’s central lesson that everyone walks their own path, and how that idea challenged Scott to trade judgment for a little more grace. The Camino ultimately became something bigger than a 500-mile adventure, showing how endurance fitness can take us far beyond races and into experiences that may actually change how we live.

EPISODE SPONSORS
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If we use yours on a weekly episode, you get a pair of the new Sanctum SL glasses!
Get 20% off with code TRN20

09:50 | What Do You Carry for 500 Miles?
From a sub-20-pound pack to albergues, hand-washed clothes, earplugs, eye masks, and rain gear, Scott explains what daily life on the Camino actually looks like.

23:23 | The People Become the Story
Scott describes more than 100 meaningful encounters and how strangers from around the world quickly moved past small talk into remarkably personal conversations.

43:43 | Ryan Joins the Camino
Ryan arrives for the final 300 kilometers, bringing a fresh perspective, some early IT-band trouble, and an unforgettable stretch of father-son time.

48:16 | Harder Than an Ultrarunner Expected
Fifteen to 20 miles sounds manageable until it becomes roughly 100 miles a week, every week, with a pack and no traditional recovery days.

51:29 | No Running, Better Fitness?
After five weeks of walking, Scott returns home noticeably fitter, runs his usual loop about a minute per mile faster, and reports a 10-beat drop in resting heart rate.

58:40 | The Lesson of the Empty Cup
Scott and Ryan unpack the deeper lessons of the Camino: doing hard things, giving people more grace, letting others find their own path, and realizing that endurance adventures don’t need a bib or a finish-line clock to matter.

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In this new Aging As An Athlete episode wtih Krissy Moehl, Coach Kirk Keller has been running since 1974, and nearly six decades later, he’s still training, racing, coaching, and figuring things out. He joins The Nation to talk about one of the hardest lessons for aging athletes: the training that worked years ago may not be the training your body needs today. The conversation covers consistency, recovery, RPE, mental training, durability, and the danger of comparing today’s pace to an earlier version of yourself. Kirk also shares a fresh lesson from the Bridger Ridge Run, where tired legs forced him to reconsider his own recovery and training load, proving that even an experienced coach still has to keep rewriting the playbook. Krissy adds her perspective on how experience, durability, life stress, and smarter recovery have changed her approach to training in her 40s. The bigger message is encouraging: aging changes the athlete, but it can also bring wisdom, perspective, problem-solving skills, and a deeper appreciation for simply being out there.

LINKS:

• Kirk Keller Coaching
• Krissy Moehl Coaching and Races

EPISODE SPONSORS
Tifosi Optics - CLARITY ON THE TRAIL: Post your Golden Nugget of wisdom that helps you recover after a huge effort on Instagram, tag @TifosiOptics, @TrailRunnerNation, and use the hashtag #ClarityOnTheTrail. OR try texting us (within the USA) with your tip: 916-235-3928.
If we use yours on a weekly episode, you get a pair of the new Sanctum SL glasses!

RunMotion Coach: Whether you’re training for your first trail race or chasing a new ultra PR, RunMotion Coach creates a personalized training plan that adapts to your schedule, fitness, and progress. Built by experienced coaches and powered by intelligent coaching technology, it helps you train smarter, stay consistent, and arrive at the starting line ready for your next adventure.

07:35 – Can We Still Get Faster as We Age?
The group examines age, previous training history, accumulated mileage, and why personal bests mean something different depending on when someone began running.

12:58 – Consistency, Durability, and Training After 40
Kirk identifies consistency as a major predictor of success and explains why older athletes may need a flatter, more patient approach to building toward big goals.

29:58 – The Biggest Mistake Aging Athletes Make
Kirk argues that denying the effects of age can hold runners back, while accepting change creates room to adjust and keep doing meaningful things on the trail.

34:54 – Why RPE Becomes More Valuable With Age
They discuss using perceived effort instead of chasing old splits, giving runners a more useful way to measure effort across changing terrain and changing bodies.

37:28 – Training the Aging Runner’s Brain
Kirk explains why mental skills remain trainable and how runners can recognize negative thoughts, verbalize them, and replace them during difficult moments.

43:38 – A Coach Learns His Own Recovery Lesson
After struggling early at the Bridger Ridge Run, Kirk realizes he had stacked hard training too closely together and needs to rethink recovery at age 67. The conversation expands into durability, wisdom, changing expectations, and the value of continually experimenting with training as we age.

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Matt Fitzgerald returns to Trail Runner Nation to talk about his deeply personal book Dying to Run: An Athlete’s Quest for One More Finish and the long COVID diagnosis that transformed his life as a runner. After more than three years without running, Matt signed up for a 100K desert ultra, Javalina Hundred, despite believing he had only about a 10 percent chance of even making it to the start line. The conversation explores how he cautiously rebuilt enough fitness to attempt the race, but the bigger story is how he redefined success from achieving a result to refusing to let his disease decide who he could be. Matt talks candidly about running as identity, community, addiction, and something that left a hole nothing else could completely fill when it disappeared. He also explains how Stoicism helped him accept reality without surrendering to it, and how suffering became something he could use rather than simply something he had to escape. Most powerfully, Matt says he would make the same choices again, even knowing long COVID was waiting for him, because removing the hardship would also remove the person he became through it.

LINKS
Dream Run Camp

EPISODE SPONSORS
Tifosi Optics - CLARITY ON THE TRAIL: Post your Golden Nugget of wisdom that helps you recover after a huge effort on Instagram, tag @TifosiOptics, @TrailRunnerNation, and use the hashtag #ClarityOnTheTrail. OR try texting us (within the USA) with your tip: 916-235-3928.
If we use yours on a weekly episode, you get a pair of the new Sanctum SL glasses!

05:14 – Living With Long COVID
Matt describes the neurological symptoms, post-exertional crashes, loss of function, and the realization that “recovery” may never mean returning to his old body.

09:32 – Training With a 10% Chance of Starting
Forty pounds above his former racing weight and badly deconditioned, Matt begins with walking and tries to carefully build just enough fitness without triggering another major setback.

19:22 – The Voices That Tell Us to Stop
The conversation turns to suffering, pride, competitiveness, and the surprising realization that Matt’s biggest struggle wasn't quitting, but accepting that he could no longer perform like the athlete he once was.

23:25 – When Running Becomes Your Identity
Matt wrestles with an uncomfortable question: what happens when running isn't simply something you do, but a central piece of who you are?

28:03 – Stoicism, Suffering and Redefining Success
Matt explains how Stoic ideas helped him face reality without self-pity and redefine success around how he responded to circumstances rather than what he accomplished.

47:12 – Who Are You Without the Circus?
Matt reflects on a lifetime of achievement, his changing definition of happiness, Dream Run Camp, and why he would still choose the path that led to long COVID because of what the experience ultimately taught him.

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