What does it actually mean to love—not just in theory, but in real life?

In this episode, Fr. Michael Trummer is joined by Fr. Christopher Trummer and Mike Nolan for a deep, honest conversation on love (charity) as the greatest theological virtue. Moving beyond clichés and sentimentality, they explore why love is both a gift of grace and something we must actively cooperate with—and why knowing about love is very different from actually living it.

The conversation touches on:

• Why love is the only virtue that endures into heaven
• How love is fulfilled not by doing more, but by delighting in the other
• The difference between Christian love and merely “being nice”
• Why loving difficult people is essential for spiritual growth
• How unhealed wounds and failure to receive love make loving others so hard
• The relationship between agape (self-giving love) and eros (delight and desire)
• Why heaven is not a glorified vacation—but perfect communion

This episode challenges listeners to examine whether their love is rooted in busyness, duty, and performance—or in real communion, hope, and grace. It’s a practical, demanding, and deeply hopeful vision of love as preparation for heaven and participation in God’s own life.

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00:00 Introduction to Theological Virtues

00:58 The Paradox of Love and Grace

02:07 Love in the Context of Faith and Hope

03:38 The Uniqueness of Christian Love

08:21 Love as Preparation for Heaven

12:09 The Role of Emotions in Love

22:43 The Challenge of Loving Difficult People

25:55 Integrating Agape and Eros

41:35 Understanding Self-Agreement and Interior Brokenness

42:26 The Difficulty of Receiving Love

42:48 The Trinity and the Nature of Love

44:05 The Impact of Being Loved

44:43 The Heart Magnifies What It Receives

47:36 The Role of Security in Love

48:41 Experiencing True Friendship and Love

54:48 The Importance of Hope in Love

59:19 Patience and the Unveiling of Love

01:06:36 The Impossible Vocation of Love

01:11:55 The Necessity of Gentleness in Love

01:17:04 Closing Thoughts and Prayer

What is faith—really?

In this episode of The Normal Christian Life, we continue our series on the theological virtues by exploring faith: what it is, what it isn’t, and why it cannot be reduced to intellectual agreement or apologetics alone.

This conversation unpacks:

• Why biblical faith is relational and lived, not merely believed
• How faith engages the whole person—mind, heart, will, and action
• The proper role of reason in the life of faith
• Why dryness, doubt, and desolation do not mean faith is failing
• How God’s hiddenness can actually deepen trust
• The importance of community, testimony, and perseverance

Drawing from Scripture (especially Hebrews 11), the saints, and lived experience, we show that faith is not emotional hype or blind guessing—but a conviction that endures even when God feels absent.

If you’ve ever wondered:

• “Why doesn’t God feel close anymore?”
• “Is my faith weak if I don’t feel anything?”
• “How do I keep believing through suffering or silence?”

This episode offers clarity, realism, and hope.

Faith is a gift—and a response—that matures through trust, surrender, and perseverance.

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00:00 Introduction to Theological Virtues

02:17 Understanding Faith: Beyond Intellectual Assent

06:25 Personal Faith Journeys

09:48 Faith and Reason: A Harmonious Relationship

13:12 Experiencing God: Faith and Feelings

23:11 Faith in Action: Living Out Beliefs

30:07 Struggles with Faith and Desolation

31:44 Understanding God's Hiddenness

34:58 The Role of Suffering in Faith

50:35 The Importance of Community in Faith

53:24 Evangelization and Personal Testimonies

58:55 Concluding Thoughts and Prayer