Just Access: The Real Transition is a 10-part podcast series from PARI (the Public Affairs Research Institute) exploring what a truly just transition means for South Africa, not only in energy policy, but in access to land, water, power, decision-making and economic opportunity.

Episode 9 brings two central voices in the series together to ask a bigger question, what would it actually take to make justice real?

Tasneem Essop convenes economist Dr Tracy Ledger and political economist Dr Sithembile Mbete to move beyond policy detail and interrogate the deeper political and economic choices shaping the transition.

The episode begins by challenging a core assumption, that inclusion alone is enough. In South Africa, millions are already included in the economy and energy system, but on deeply unequal terms. As a result, inclusion without equity often reproduces exclusion.

From there, the conversation opens up. What counts as “justice” in the transition is not agreed, and different definitions lead to very different outcomes. For some, it is about reducing emissions. For others, it is about compensating workers and regions tied to coal. But a broader view asks how the transition can fundamentally reshape an economy built on inequality.

The episode argues that current approaches risk simply replacing one system with another, swapping fossil fuels for renewables while leaving the underlying structure of the economy intact. Concepts like “green growth” may expand industries, but without addressing equity, they are unlikely to reduce poverty or exclusion.

At the heart of the discussion is a deeper constraint, a lack of political and economic imagination. Policy debates remain siloed, and opportunities to rethink how resources, energy, and economic power are distributed are often missed. Yet the transition also opens up real possibilities, especially if cheaper, decentralized energy can support new forms of livelihoods and more distributed economic participation.

Episode 9 makes a clear argument, the just transition is not only about changing energy sources. It is about rethinking the rules of the economy itself, and deciding who benefits from that change.

Subscribe to follow the full series, and to learn more about PARI and their research, visit www.pari.org.za

Just Access: The Real Transition is a 10-part podcast series from PARI (the Public Affairs Research Institute) exploring what a truly just transition means for South Africa, not only in energy policy, but in access to land, water, power, decision-making and economic opportunity.

Episode 8 asks a practical question, what does accountability look like on the ground?

Building on the previous episode’s focus on co-production, this episode turns to how participation and collaboration can work inside municipalities. Tasneem Essop speaks with researcher Kate Tissington, whose work through the COMPACT partnership focuses on strengthening relationships between communities and local government.

Despite strong policy commitments to participatory democracy, the reality is often very different. In many municipalities, engagement has broken down, trust is low, and accountability mechanisms are weak. Participation frequently happens too late, after decisions have already been made, leading to frustration and, in many cases, protest.

The episode explores practical ways to shift this. Approaches such as citizen-based monitoring and collaborative planning bring together communities, councillors and officials to work on shared problems. Rather than consultation as a formality, these models aim to create ongoing relationships where information flows more openly and responsibility is shared.

At the same time, the episode returns to coal-affected communities in Mpumalanga. Researcher Mahlatse Rampedi describes how, in the absence of clear state leadership, communities are finding their own ways to adapt. From cooperatives to informal economies, people are building resilience and navigating uncertainty with limited support.

Episode 8 makes a clear argument, accountability is not only about systems or policies. It is about relationships. A just transition depends on rebuilding trust between institutions and the people they serve, and on creating spaces where decisions are shaped together, not imposed from above.

Subscribe to follow the full series, and to learn more about PARI and their research, visit www.pari.org.za

Just Access: The Real Transition is a 10-part podcast series from PARI (the Public Affairs Research Institute) exploring what a truly just transition means for South Africa, not only in energy policy, but in access to land, water, power, decision-making and economic opportunity.

Episode 7 turns to a critical question, how do we move from policy promises to real, lived change?

While the language of participation is widely used in policymaking, this episode challenges how participation actually works in practice. Tasneem Essop speaks again with economist Dr Tracy Ledger to unpack the limits of traditional public consultation and to introduce an alternative approach, co-production.

The episode argues that most policymaking processes engage communities too late, after problems have already been defined and solutions designed. In these models, participation becomes a checkbox exercise, rather than a meaningful way of shaping outcomes. As a result, policies often fail not because of poor implementation, but because they were never grounded in the realities they are meant to address.

Co-production offers a different approach. It involves communities at the very beginning of the process, helping to define the problem itself. This shifts the role of citizens from passive participants to active contributors, recognising that those living with the challenges often have the most accurate understanding of them.

The episode also highlights how narrow data and formal economic metrics can obscure the full picture. In coal-affected regions, for example, policymakers often overlook informal work, community support systems, and services provided by mining companies, all of which are central to people’s livelihoods. When these realities are excluded from planning, entire dimensions of the transition remain invisible.

Episode 7 makes a clear case, a just transition cannot be designed from the top down. It must be built with communities, from the ground up, through processes that value lived experience as essential knowledge, not an afterthought.

Subscribe to follow the full series, and to learn more about PARI and their research, visit www.pari.org.za