This episode was recorded during the roofing boom—when being busy hid bad numbers. Today, work is slower and margins are tighter. Dave explains why job costing is now the difference between surviving and disappearing, and why “gut feel” leaves contractors broke even even when they’re busy.

This interview was recorded a few years ago when the roofing market was on fire. Phones were ringing, jobs were everywhere, and being busy hid a lot of sins.

Today it’s different.

Jobs are harder to get. Margins are thinner. And the contractors who don’t truly understand their numbers—what jobs actually make money, what crews are profitable, what their real labor cost is—those companies won’t survive this market.

I hear it every week:

“Dave, we’re working like crazy… but there’s never any money in the bank.”

That’s not bad luck. That’s no job costing.

Successful contractors job cost every job. Unsuccessful ones run on gut feel—and in this market, gut feel will put you out of business.

In this conversation, Dave Sullivan sits down with construction finance expert Leslie Shiner to break down the simple job costing system profitable roofers use to protect margins and make real decisions.

You’ll Learn

1. Why “gut feel” lies—and cash proves it
2. The real reason busy roofers still have no money
3. How to calculate true labor cost (labor burden)
4. Paid hours vs billable hours = labor utilization
5. Why labor overruns destroy profit faster than materials
6. How estimate vs actual fixes bad pricing
7. How to see which crews and job types make money
8. Two KPIs every roofer must track

00:00 – Why this matters now

02:20 – Gut feel vs real profit

06:20 – What job costing actually means

10:15 – True labor cost & labor burden

17:30 – Labor utilization explained

24:15 – Estimate vs actual the right way

30:25 – Fixing downtime & productivity

36:40 – Sales to production handoff

40:35 – KPIs that matter

44:15 – Improving your system

Shiner Group: https://www.shinergroup.com

Free Labor Burden Calculator (on Leslie’s site)

Work with Dave / Mentoring: https://theroofercoach.com/mentoring/

Free resources: https://theroofercoach.com/resources/

Connect with Dave!

Text Dave: (510) 612-1450

Free Strategy Call

Want to grow a more profitable roofing business?

Book a free strategy call with Dave here → davesullivan.as.me/free-strategy-call

Free Resource

Download your FREE 1-Page Business Plan for Roofing Contractors → theroofercoach.com/plan

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As we head into 2026, many roofing contractors are rethinking how they build their business—focusing less on chaos and top-line growth, and more on profitability, structure, and long-term value.

In this episode, Dave Sullivan sits down with Tim Brown of Hook Agency, who’s doing something unexpected: launching his own roofing company, Owl Roofing. Dave walks Tim through the One-Page Business Plan framework to pressure-test the idea, clarify the strategy, and uncover the real challenges that come with starting a roofing business the right way.

This conversation goes far beyond marketing. Tim and Dave dig into storm work vs. retail, branding and positioning, financing-first selling, leadership depth, production risks, and what it really takes to build a roofing company that can grow without relying on the owner every day.

If you’re planning your 2026 strategy—or thinking about starting, scaling, or eventually stepping back from your business—this episode will sharpen your thinking fast.

What you’ll hear in this episode:

1. Why Tim Brown is launching Owl Roofing and what he hopes to build
2. Using the One-Page Business Plan to create clarity and direction
3. Storm work vs. retail roofing and how to think about the mix
4. Why being “five-mile-famous” beats spreading marketing thin
5. The two biggest homeowner complaints: communication and clean-up
6. Financing-first selling: why homeowners buy payments, not prices
7. Dave’s three-legged stool framework: Sell Work, Do Work, Keep Score
8. The real risks in roofing: hiring, production handoffs, insurance tightening, and cash flow
9. Building a business that creates options—sell it, step back, or keep it cash flowing

Resources mentioned:

1. Free One-Page Business Plan for Roofing Contractors → https://theroofercoach.com/resources
2. Roofing Success Audit → https://theroofercoach.com/resources
3. Hook Agency → https://hookagency.com

Trusted & Vetted Sponsors:

1. Ruby Receptionists – US-based professionals who answer your phones live, create a great first impression, and tee up the sale so you can focus on running your business.
2. Get $150 off your first month → https://theroofercoach.com/ruby
3. ProLine – The roofing CRM that sells more jobs and helps you make it home for dinner. Automate follow-up, quoting, and...

As we head into 2026, homeowners are still turning to Google when they need a roofer, and local visibility continues to drive high-quality leads. Many contractors spend money on marketing without understanding how local SEO and Google Maps actually work. In this episode, Dave breaks down the fundamentals of local search, what really drives inbound leads, and how to improve visibility without relying solely on paid ads.

If homeowners can’t find you on Google, you don’t exist.

In this episode, I sit down with local SEO expert Dima Sobovoy to break down how roofing contractors can win more jobs by showing up where it matters most, Google Maps and local search.

We talk about why many roofing websites and SEO campaigns fail, what Google actually looks for when ranking local contractors, and how simple changes can dramatically improve visibility without chasing gimmicks or shortcuts.

This episode is about building a strong local presence that consistently generates qualified leads, not just clicks.

Local SEO isn’t optional for roofing contractors; it’s foundational.

In this episode, Dave Sullivan talks with Dima Sobovoy about what actually drives local rankings for roofers and home service businesses. They break down the common mistakes contractors make with SEO, why “set it and forget it” marketing doesn’t work, and how Google Maps has become one of the most powerful lead sources in local markets.

Dima explains the importance of Google Business Profiles, reviews, proximity, relevance, and consistency, and how contractors can improve their local presence without massive ad budgets. The conversation also covers how SEO fits into a broader business system, so leads don’t go to waste once the phone starts ringing.

If you want more inbound leads from homeowners actively searching for a roofer in your area, this episode lays out the fundamentals you need to understand.

This episode is a replay of a previously published episode of The Roofer Show. We’re bringing it back because the message is especially relevant as contractors plan for 2026.

Original episode: https://theroofershow.com/418

What you’ll hear in this episode:

1. Google Maps visibility is critical for roofing contractors
2. Local SEO drives higher-intent leads than many paid ads
3. Google Business Profiles must be actively managed, not ignored
4. Reviews, consistency, and relevance matter more than tricks
5. SEO only works when paired with strong follow-up systems
6. Long-term local visibility beats short-term marketing hacks

Resources:

Connect with Dave!

Text Dave: (510) 612-1450

Free Strategy Call

Want to grow a more profitable roofing business? Book a free strategy call with Dave here → davesullivan.as.me/free-strategy-call

Free Resource

Download your FREE 1-Page Business Plan for Roofing Contractors → theroofershow.com/plan

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