How should we respond to the risks posed by AI and disinformation? And can AI be used defensively? In this episode, Simon sits down with Mike Speirs, Customer Director at Faculty, who is working to transform defense and national security capabilities through AI. The two discuss the impact of corporate disinformation, in addition to political disinformation, and the importance of digital literacy.

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“We are moving away from the space where you'll look at an image and you'll see someone with six fingers. That's pretty easy for someone to pick up. That kind of window of opportunity of being able to pick up on those types of really obvious tells of a synthetic image is starting to close out.”

“Most people are unaware that there is also a huge economic cost of disinformation. It targets corporations as well as countries.”

Timestamps:

(02:14) Unpacking the different types of deepfakes

(07:57) The cost of corporate disinformation

(11:34) How should we respond to the risks posed by deepfakes and disinformation?

(14:07) Is watermarking effective?

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Mike Speirs on LinkedIn
Simon Horswell on LinkedIn

The Fraud Lab

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How can we encourage intel sharing between the private and public sector, while meeting regulations and protecting privacy? In this episode, Simon discusses reciprocity in intel-sharing with Jim Hitchcock, VP of Fraud Prevention at American Bankers Association. There Jim serves as the association’s primary expert on fraud mitigation activities and programs. The two also discuss the resurgence of low tech scams and social engineering to beat automated defenses.

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“I just sat down with the US Secret Service…. What they were saying was they get a little frustrated in the sense of not understanding why, when they might call a financial institution and say, “Hey, there's fraudulent money coming your way”, they may freeze that money, send it back to the initial, the sending institution, but then things just kind of end there and they don't get any positive feedback. And all the secret service is trying to do is collect more of that information to try to identify a real person that they could go out and talk to and maybe arrest later on down the street.”

“Financial institutions also have concerns about the lack of law enforcement feedback. But law enforcement can't always give feedback, right? Because….if they're sitting on an individual that they might arrest, sometimes you just can't give that information back. They might have had grand jury documents out to obtain some of this information.So there's secrecy issues there.”

Timestamps:

(01:28) The challenges of intel sharing between the private sector and law enforcement

(08:43) Are there concerns of the government showing favoritism to certain companies?

(15:58) Is there equal reciprocity when sharing information?

(20:42) Pig-butchering compounds in SE Asia

(26:10) A rise in low-tech, in-person scams

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Jim Hitchcok on LinkedIn
Simon Horswell on LinkedIn

The Fraud Lab

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How can businesses discourage friendly fraud and what is a professional disputer? In this episode, Simon is joined by Michael Fox, who has significant experience in fraud detection in the financial industry, having worked for President’s Choice Financial, Capital One and Meridian Credit Union before moving to his current role at KOHO, a Neobank based in Canada. The two discuss the evolution of fraud and detection efforts, as well as the rise in friendly fraud and dispute fraud.

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“It is often what I call a crime of opportunity where it's a boyfriend or a relative or a grandson. This is often not professional fraudsters going out there and doing complicated hacks. It is that crime of opportunity. Somebody needs a little bit of money and they do that.”

Timestamps:

(01:07) Intro to Michael and Koho

(02:05) How has fraud evolved?

(06:48) What is friendly fraud?

(11:36) What can businesses do to stop friendly fraud?

(13:09) How has fraud detection evolved over the past couple of years?

(19:34) Building trust through good friction

(22:10) Big upcoming change due to deepfakes

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Michael Fox on LinkedIn
Simon Horswell on LinkedIn

The Fraud Lab

Onfido’s Identity Fraud Report

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What is insider risk, and how can it be detected? In this episode, Simon is joined by Dave Burroughs, a fraud and forensic investigations expert who spent 25 years in the FBI and continues to offer his expertise in fraud as a Partner at Stoneturn, a global professional services firm. They discuss all things insider risk: what it is, the motivations behind it, and the red flags to look out for.

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“Insider risk has a lot of definitions, but, generally speaking, it's really anyone (that could be an employee, a subcontractor, a fellow, a partner of the organization) who has access to information and or assets and maliciously or unwittingly exploits that access and basically exposes those assets.”

“[Company culture] is a key factor. Your technology is only going to take you so far.”

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Time stamps:

(01:37) What is insider risk?

(04:12) What motivates insiders to act nefariously?

(07:06) How company culture impacts insider risk

(08:31) Red flags to look out for

(12:32) What role does technology pay?

(16:06) Surprises and lessons from Dave’s time in the FBI

(21:10) The most interesting fraud case Dave has worked on

(24:14) The longest case he’s worked on

(26:33) How will the fraud landscape change in the next few years?

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Dave Burroughs on LinkedIn
Simon Horswell on LinkedIn

The Fraud Lab

Onfido’s Identity Fraud Report

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How can businesses protect themselves against deepfakes? In this episode, Simon is joined by Ahron Geminder, Global Head of Digital Identity, Wealth & Personal Banking at HSBC, to discuss fraud detection and prevention in the banking industry. They dive into how AI is changing the landscape, the imminent challenges presented by deepfakes, and how to take a black mirror approach when thinking about potential issues.

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“If you want zero fraud, then you have zero customers.”

“Deep fakes are going to become the norm. I think it's going to become a lot more prolific than we have right now. I think prevention for deep fakes is probably going to be one of the biggest challenges that most companies are going to face.”

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Time stamps:

(01:15) How is the fraud landscape changing?

(05:03) The impact of bias and familiarity

(06:22) Finding the balance between prevention and user experience

(12:58) Organized fraudsters versus lone wolves

(17:46) Challenges across the industry from generative AI / deep fakes

(21:34) The Black Mirror Approach

(23:50) What does Ahron see coming next?

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Ahron Geminder on LinkedIn
Simon Horswell on LinkedIn

The Fraud Lab

Onfido’s Identity Fraud Report

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How can companies balance the user experience with security? In this episode, Simon is joined by Vincent Guillevic, Director of Product Management and Head of The Fraud Lab at Onfido. They discuss the focus of The Fraud Lab and why it is needed, diving into the current fraud landscape and the future of fraud prevention.

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“Everything that tends to make our life more secure tends to also have a higher friction. And everything that has more friction tends to make our life less secure. So you definitely want to find the right balance here.”

“The first mistake that I see is having teams that are too siloed, meaning that the onboarding team or the UX team working on the onboarding of their service or platform or product are too siloed from their fraud and risk team.”

“We always think about friction as something negative. There is also a positive aspect to friction.”

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(03:13) Vincent’s role

(04:44) What is the focus of The Fraud Lab?

(06:26) Kickstarting an ML a model

(09:26) How does UX Design impact fraud detection?

(11:00) Common user-experience mistakes when preventing fraud

(13:11) ROI and pitching technology

(15:06) Balancing friction with security

(17:40) Staying ahead of changes in the industry

(20:41) How will the industry change in coming years?

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Vincent Guillevic on LinkedIn
Simon Horswell on LinkedIn

The Fraud Lab

Onfido’s Identity Fraud Report

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On Apple Podcast

Has there ever been an easier time to be a professional fraudster? In this episode, Simon is joined by Brittany Allen, Trust and Safety Architect at Sift to discuss the rise of the “fraud influencer” and “fraud-as-a-service”. They discuss fraud rings, task scams, and social engineering, then dive into Brittany’s undercover work on the deep and dark web and the impact of AI.

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“There's also the side of it that's fraud-as-a-service, where these same criminals have realized, yes, I could keep getting this information, I could keep using it for myself, but also I can build up a business if I'm just the middle man who repackages that information.”

“If they're able to then reach people who aren't comfortable joining fraud channels, who are worried about getting caught or the consequences of fraud…then, why not try to reach them where they are? And that brings us to the fraud influencers.”

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Time stamps:

01:19 Fraud rings and social engineering

02:40 Task scams and social engineering

07:13 “Pig butchering” scams

10:52 The rise of fraud influencers and fraud-as-a-service

20:37 Exploring the deep web and dark web

26:33 Recent changes in identity document fraud

34:9 The impact of AI and the increase of deep fakes

38:46 Final thoughts and predictions

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Brittany Allen on LinkedIn
Simon Horswell on LinkedIn

The Fraud Lab

Onfido’s Identity Fraud Report

[Subscribe to the Podcast]
On Apple Podcasts

Fraud is big business. In fact, it’s a professional industry. We’re talking trillions of dollars lost by businesses to fraud every year — an industry more profitable than the entire global illegal drug trade, combined. In the digital age, there are sophisticated threats around every corner. If you’re responsible for protecting your company from fraud, it can seem impossible to keep up. And that’s why we’re here to help.

On our show, you’ll hear from the world’s top fraud experts on what they’re seeing in the field — from fraud rings, to synthetic identities, to AI-generated deepfakes — so you can learn how to keep your business a step ahead in the fraud arms race.

Welcome Inside the Fraud Lab. Brought to you by the identity experts at Onfido.