This week the guys dip back into Marrou, where the author pivots like Yaxel Lendeborg to the Roman side of things. H.I. takes up the "Old Roman Education". Immediately we notice realities that put the lie to the loose notion that the Romans just took from the Greeks and changed the names. While, yes, eventually much of Roman education merges with the Hellenistic ideals explored earlier (and later) tome-wise, at its root, Roman education was fundamentally a different enterprise. Much more than the Greeks, the Roman centered their approach around tradition, the state, and the family. Mos maiorum reigned supreme. The “noble peasant” ideal (even if later on you lived in a high-rise next to the Colosseum and sipped cocktails with your Greek besties) is there at the beginning and never fully disappears. The chief lesson? Even if you show up with an army of Volsci ready to overthrow the state, you still gotta listen to your momma.

"There are the life events that have been apportioned to you. Live in harmony with them. There are the people whose destiny is to live at the same time as you. Love them. (Make sure you really feel it.)" (Meditations 6.39) This week Jeff and Dave sit down with Aaron Poochigian – experienced translator, poet, and all-around Classics enthusiast – to discuss his new translation from W.W. Norton of the Meditations (ad se ipsum) of the Roman emperor Marcus Aurelius (r. 161-180). Stoicism is on the menu, as well as great nuggets of advice like "don't let yourself be Caesarified. It can happen". And, "be careful not to wear royal attire at home". What can Marcus, who never intended his private ruminations to be published, teach us about suffering, wisdom, fear of death, and more? Tune in to hear from this fascinating author, transmitted through an equally fascinating interpreter.

Ok, AdNaserinos, you have slogged your way through 214 episodes of this humble podcast, patiently enduring many digressions, running gags, and inside jokes. You have also heard the hosts gush over the wit and brilliance of Publius Ovidius Naso, and the many vignettes mined from his Metamorphoses. For this Gurgle, Dave and Jeff take a quick bite of an important article from the journal Phoenix, Winter 1959, by G.B. Riddehough. Citing Ovid's "wonderful power of differentiation", Riddehough seeks to connect the dots between the endless changes into birds, bears (no beets), fish, and other bestial creepy crawlies that fill the pages of this most unconventional epic. What themes emerge? When a human being takes on fins, scales, feathers, or fangs, does he retain his core identity, a man trapped in an animal's body? Or is there something else that's happening? What does it mean to be quintessentially human, to possess humanities? And what happens when that is ripped away? For keen interpretive insight on Ovid, this is one you don't want to miss.