Your racing heart can’t tell fear from excitement. Your brain picks the label, and you can help it choose.

In this episode of Calm With Me, Dr. Meredith Calvert explores why fear so often shows up the moment we try something new: a first giant stride off a dive boat, a rock face, a wobbly balancing pose. She explains why fear and excitement feel nearly identical in the body, how valence (with a nerdy detour into ambivalence) shapes the story we tell about that rush, and why the amygdala behaves like an overcautious smoke detector.

Drawing on the work of surfer and researcher Ralph Buckley, Meredith unpacks why the dread on the boat often outweighs anything felt during the dive itself, and why good adventure lives in the middle of the fear-thrill “sawtooth.” A 2025 MIT study shows dopamine arriving at the exact instant fear lets go, writing a new memory over the old one. Research on adventurous play in kids, and on adventure athletes (spoiler: they’re not adrenaline junkies), reveals what waits on the other side.

The episode closes with five practical tools, including a guided “Name it, feel it, thank it” practice, and a poem about a river trembling at the edge of the sea. Plus: the 2027 WildCalm Retreats waitlist is now open!!

Mentioned in this episode:
The WildCalm retreats waitlist for 2027 is now open, from scuba diving in French Polynesia to hiking in Joshua Tree. All WildCalm retreats are small by design, and I expect them to fill quickly. Joining now means you’ll hear from me first. Join the private waitlist. No commitment or payment yet, just your place in line.
Immersive experiences designed to help you slow down, breathe more deeply, and reconnect with yourself, through movement, breath, and nature.

• Find out more: WildCalm Retreats
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Time Stamps:
0:00 – Why adventure brings fear
1:10 – Intro: who Meredith is
2:00 – Fear and excitement feel nearly identical
2:40 – Arousal and valence
3:05 – Nerdy sidetrack: ambivalence (and starting a family)
5:20 – The amygdala as a smoke detector
6:25 – Ralph Buckley: anxiety before vs. fear during
7:40 – Fast fear vs. slow anxiety
8:15 – Fear boosts performance, panic causes paralysis
9:15 – The fear-thrill “sawtooth”
9:50 – MIT study: dopamine and fear extinction
11:25 – Why adventure matters: lessons from kids
12:20 – “As safe as necessary”
13:35 – Adventure athletes aren’t adrenaline junkies
15:00 – Tip 1: Say “I’m excited”
15:50 – Tip 2: Lengthen your exhale
16:20 – Tip 3: Find something useful to do
17:10 – Tip 4: Name it
17:40 – Tip 5: Guided practice: Name it, feel it, thank it
20:20 – Poem: “Fear,” attributed to Khalil Gibran
21:20 – 2027 WildCalm Retreats waitlist + sign-off

References:

• Buckley, R. C. (2016). Qualitative Analysis of Emotions: Fear and Thrill. Frontiers in Psychology, 7, 1187.
• Zhang, X., Flick, K., et al., & Tonegawa, S. (2025). Dopamine induces fear extinction by activating the reward-responding amygdala neurons. PNAS.
• Dodd, H. F., & Lester, K. J. (2021). Adventurous Play as a Mechanism for Reducing Risk for Childhood Anxiety: A Conceptual Model. Clinical Child and Family Psychology Review, 24(1).
• Gray, T., Down, M. J. A., et al. (2025). Risky Outdoor Play and Adventure Education in Nature for Child and Adolescent Wellbeing: A Scoping Review. Behavioral Sciences, 16(1), 5.
• Jackson, S. A., Eklund, R. C., et al. (2023). Flow and outdoor adventure recreation: Using flow measures to re-examine motives for participation. Psychology of Sport and Exercise, 67.
• Brooks, A. W. (2014). Get Excited: Reappraising Pre-Performance Anxiety as Excitement. Journal of Experimental Psychology: General, 143(3).
• Lieberman, M. D., et al. (2007). Putting Feelings into Words: Affect Labeling Disrupts Amygdala Activity. Psychological Science, 18(5).